I had some contacts in Vietnam that did report to me and will never forget a meeting in the Saigon Zoo park where some American with a butterfly net surveilled me. And I have no doubt that Jeff did much better than I did.
But my comment is on some who saw too much in electronic interceptions. In my opinion and that of others Saddam deceived us with intercepted communications. He might have know of fake divisions in Britian before D Day. I asked David Packer about that and he wrote: "A. This is the other half of the WMD fiasco: much of the world, including congressional Democrats, European intelligence services, and United Nations agencies, believed that Saddam had some WMDs -- at least, chemical weapons stockpiles and a biological program. This was far less than the administration was claiming before the war; there's a world of difference between chemical stockpiles and a nuclear program capable of producing a bomb within a year or two. But it was grounds for some worry. According to the report of Charles Duelfer and the Iraq Survey Group, Saddam himself created the illusion that he had some capabilities in order to keep his old enemy Iran at bay; in the madhouse logic of his last years, he was lying to his generals and being lied to by his scientists. He played cat and mouse with the inspectors when they return in late 2002. In this and other ways, Saddam brought about his own downfall. As for the Democrats, some of them also have themselves to blame because they failed to look closely at the caveats buried in the October 2002 National Intelligence Estimate on Iraq. At the same time, they had less access to intelligence than the President and his top officials."
Oct 22, 2023·edited Oct 22, 2023Liked by Jeff Stein
I'm sure you will inform us, but when we do learn of "who" these Hamas "spymasters" are, I'd be inclined to believe they have learned their tradecraft DIY by reading the internet.
Internet information sharing and availability of how to DIY spycraft leading up to this Hamas attack on Israel, how many professional trained spy people, or how much is just easily studied up spy craft available.
Are these Hamas spymasters DIY, or pro trained and/or guided by pros from Syria and Iran? I guess even asking that means likely Iran as the answer.
Old adages like "eye for an eye" "you reap what you sow" versus "turn the other cheek" and "the meek shall inherit the earth" (the last which I have privately held to the interpretation that those killing each other will leave behind those who were meekly waiting it out for the inspired warriors to kill each other), inevitably come to my mind. My conclusion: Diplomacy good, and devious eye for an eye is ultimately bad. Spycraft for defensive action, good. Revenge killing keeps unwittingly kicking the can of human to human inhumanity down the road. US policy I've always thought restraint, eliminate collateral damage and target through spy craft where the insane determined murderers are plotting and activating themselves, to pre-empt them, that seems moral.
Much appreciate your sub stack, hope you are well and live long. Excellent job, every article I read of yours.
Endless praise to US diplomats, State Department good guys, and all the good Non Governmental groups and think tanks working to dampen human to human inhumanity.
I just hope the smartest youth in US take careers leading to career US Govt agencies' jobs so the best minds do what's the best for the world.
Thanks for your thoughtful note, Chuck—and for reading SpyTalk. Appreciate your compliments for what we're doing. . . . The Palestinians hardly need much instruction on espionage: they've been spying on the Jewish state since at least 1948. What Iran may have brought to the table for their current campaign is advice on deception activities to lull Israeli defenders. Otherwise, what Iran has to offer is tradecraft updates, from concealment methods to state-of-the-art covert communications gear. That said, by the looks of their barbaric Oct. 7 rampage, they certainly weren't beeing subtle.
I am New to SPYTALK and I joined to hear some current stories on SPYING in the US.
Although this story is very interesting and does point out some KEY ISSUES for SPYING
I am still looking for the story here in the US and not the failures in the Middle East.
As pointed out and I quote " By the end of the century, though, advances in technology had eclipsed much of battlefield HUMINT, as human-based spying efforts are called."
Further stated "But none of that explains how Hamas was able to equip its fighters with detailed maps, right down to the layouts and manpower of Israeli police stations and the location of safe rooms in kibbutzim homes."
And now the KEY as stated in the article "That could only come from old fashioned HUMINT—eyes and ears (and cell phone cameras, no doubt) inside those settlements. Israel’s sophisticated surveillance cameras along the Gaza border were useless in detecting them."
As interesting as this article is by someone that used old-time human intelligence years ago in Vietnam does anyone here have a current story on foreign Intelligence Operating here in the US and more importantly based on the old true method of Human Intelligence which this writer knows is the KEY to SPYING. Since joining SPYTALK I have not hear one current Story about SPYING here in the US and that is why I joined. Like Humas in Gaza, the SPYS are here in the US and they are gathering information to use against us. It is just a matter of time as the clock is ticking.
Great friggin piece, Jeff!
I had some contacts in Vietnam that did report to me and will never forget a meeting in the Saigon Zoo park where some American with a butterfly net surveilled me. And I have no doubt that Jeff did much better than I did.
But my comment is on some who saw too much in electronic interceptions. In my opinion and that of others Saddam deceived us with intercepted communications. He might have know of fake divisions in Britian before D Day. I asked David Packer about that and he wrote: "A. This is the other half of the WMD fiasco: much of the world, including congressional Democrats, European intelligence services, and United Nations agencies, believed that Saddam had some WMDs -- at least, chemical weapons stockpiles and a biological program. This was far less than the administration was claiming before the war; there's a world of difference between chemical stockpiles and a nuclear program capable of producing a bomb within a year or two. But it was grounds for some worry. According to the report of Charles Duelfer and the Iraq Survey Group, Saddam himself created the illusion that he had some capabilities in order to keep his old enemy Iran at bay; in the madhouse logic of his last years, he was lying to his generals and being lied to by his scientists. He played cat and mouse with the inspectors when they return in late 2002. In this and other ways, Saddam brought about his own downfall. As for the Democrats, some of them also have themselves to blame because they failed to look closely at the caveats buried in the October 2002 National Intelligence Estimate on Iraq. At the same time, they had less access to intelligence than the President and his top officials."
OOPS! George Packer.
You make many good points, Gary. Thanks.
I'm sure you will inform us, but when we do learn of "who" these Hamas "spymasters" are, I'd be inclined to believe they have learned their tradecraft DIY by reading the internet.
Internet information sharing and availability of how to DIY spycraft leading up to this Hamas attack on Israel, how many professional trained spy people, or how much is just easily studied up spy craft available.
Are these Hamas spymasters DIY, or pro trained and/or guided by pros from Syria and Iran? I guess even asking that means likely Iran as the answer.
Old adages like "eye for an eye" "you reap what you sow" versus "turn the other cheek" and "the meek shall inherit the earth" (the last which I have privately held to the interpretation that those killing each other will leave behind those who were meekly waiting it out for the inspired warriors to kill each other), inevitably come to my mind. My conclusion: Diplomacy good, and devious eye for an eye is ultimately bad. Spycraft for defensive action, good. Revenge killing keeps unwittingly kicking the can of human to human inhumanity down the road. US policy I've always thought restraint, eliminate collateral damage and target through spy craft where the insane determined murderers are plotting and activating themselves, to pre-empt them, that seems moral.
Much appreciate your sub stack, hope you are well and live long. Excellent job, every article I read of yours.
Endless praise to US diplomats, State Department good guys, and all the good Non Governmental groups and think tanks working to dampen human to human inhumanity.
I just hope the smartest youth in US take careers leading to career US Govt agencies' jobs so the best minds do what's the best for the world.
Thanks for your thoughtful note, Chuck—and for reading SpyTalk. Appreciate your compliments for what we're doing. . . . The Palestinians hardly need much instruction on espionage: they've been spying on the Jewish state since at least 1948. What Iran may have brought to the table for their current campaign is advice on deception activities to lull Israeli defenders. Otherwise, what Iran has to offer is tradecraft updates, from concealment methods to state-of-the-art covert communications gear. That said, by the looks of their barbaric Oct. 7 rampage, they certainly weren't beeing subtle.
I am New to SPYTALK and I joined to hear some current stories on SPYING in the US.
Although this story is very interesting and does point out some KEY ISSUES for SPYING
I am still looking for the story here in the US and not the failures in the Middle East.
As pointed out and I quote " By the end of the century, though, advances in technology had eclipsed much of battlefield HUMINT, as human-based spying efforts are called."
Further stated "But none of that explains how Hamas was able to equip its fighters with detailed maps, right down to the layouts and manpower of Israeli police stations and the location of safe rooms in kibbutzim homes."
And now the KEY as stated in the article "That could only come from old fashioned HUMINT—eyes and ears (and cell phone cameras, no doubt) inside those settlements. Israel’s sophisticated surveillance cameras along the Gaza border were useless in detecting them."
As interesting as this article is by someone that used old-time human intelligence years ago in Vietnam does anyone here have a current story on foreign Intelligence Operating here in the US and more importantly based on the old true method of Human Intelligence which this writer knows is the KEY to SPYING. Since joining SPYTALK I have not hear one current Story about SPYING here in the US and that is why I joined. Like Humas in Gaza, the SPYS are here in the US and they are gathering information to use against us. It is just a matter of time as the clock is ticking.
Howard Walther, Santa Barbara, California
Well said. I learned a lot. Thanks.